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	<title>Comments on: Kim on Portland Anarchists</title>
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	<link>http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2007/03/30/kim-on-portland-anarchists/</link>
	<description>Making the Connections</description>
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		<title>By: Charlie</title>
		<link>http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2007/03/30/kim-on-portland-anarchists/#comment-71673</link>
		<dc:creator>Charlie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 May 2007 04:32:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feralscholar.org/blog/?p=485#comment-71673</guid>
		<description>Again, irrelevant.  Further, neither the author nor the poster have any idea what they are talking about.  If it was Emma&#039;s son or daughter who would be left as a target then perhaps she would think, &quot;maybe food and body armor are a good idea.&quot;  Yet, because it&#039;s not her kid that has been dropped off in hell then we should just let them all die. Sounds a lot like Bush Co&#039;s policy of bringing Al Qaeda into Iraq so we don&#039;t fight them here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Again, irrelevant.  Further, neither the author nor the poster have any idea what they are talking about.  If it was Emma&#8217;s son or daughter who would be left as a target then perhaps she would think, &#8220;maybe food and body armor are a good idea.&#8221;  Yet, because it&#8217;s not her kid that has been dropped off in hell then we should just let them all die. Sounds a lot like Bush Co&#8217;s policy of bringing Al Qaeda into Iraq so we don&#8217;t fight them here.</p>
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		<title>By: emma</title>
		<link>http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2007/03/30/kim-on-portland-anarchists/#comment-71529</link>
		<dc:creator>emma</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 May 2007 06:26:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feralscholar.org/blog/?p=485#comment-71529</guid>
		<description>Thought this article would be of interest to these discussions -

I DON&#039;T &quot;SUPPORT THE TROOPS&quot;

And I don&#039;t support any &quot;benchmarks&quot; for the Iraqis

By Nick Mottern, Director, ConsumersforPeace.org

This is a letter I am sending today to my person in Congress, Nita Lowey D-NY.   I attempted to run against Ms. Lowey in the 1990 Democratic primary because of her support of U.S. attempts to subdue Central American countries.   Here we are 17 years later with our hooks into Iraq, with Ms. Lowey&#039;s support.   Attempts to meet with her over the last two months have failed.

Dear Ms. Lowey:

  I am writing to let you know that I do not &quot;support the troops&quot; in Iraq, and that you are not representing me when you vote more money to keep &quot;the troops&quot; in Iraq.        

  Hundreds of thousands of troops have been sent to Iraqi blinded by lies.   There they have been and continue to be routinely ordered to take actions against Iraqis that violate not only our Constitution and international law but virtually every norm of religious and civil society.   All &quot;the troops&quot; should know better.

  I do not want any of my tax money to support this kind of behavior, regardless of the goal.   I feel no sense of loyalty or obligation to individuals or commanders who are daily destroying Iraqi life and culture.   In fact, I feel a need to take every non-violent step that I can think of to end this behavior.

  Ms. Lowey, you know very well that the intention of sending our military into Iraq is to establish a base of deadly force for our long-term manipulation of the Middle East, in part to ensure our oil companies will have long-term, extremely profitable access to oil.

  When you and your Democratic and Republican colleagues vote money to &quot;support the troops&quot; you know that you are taking advantage in a dispicable way of the innocence, ignorance, good will and sense of loyalty of &quot;the troops&quot; and the American public.

  Furthermore, how can you allow to go unchallenged all this talk in Congress about the need for Iraqis to meet benchmarks?   After killing more than half a million Iraqis, and with the abject suffering being visited on Iraqis by the United States each and every minute, what possible right does the United States have to even make a polite suggestion to one single Iraqi?   What is due from America is simply immediate withdrawal, apology and commitment to reparations, with the latter totally managed by Iraqis.

Sincerely,

Nick Mottern

Hastings on Hudson, New York

Posted May 9, 2007</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thought this article would be of interest to these discussions -</p>
<p>I DON&#8217;T &#8220;SUPPORT THE TROOPS&#8221;</p>
<p>And I don&#8217;t support any &#8220;benchmarks&#8221; for the Iraqis</p>
<p>By Nick Mottern, Director, ConsumersforPeace.org</p>
<p>This is a letter I am sending today to my person in Congress, Nita Lowey D-NY.   I attempted to run against Ms. Lowey in the 1990 Democratic primary because of her support of U.S. attempts to subdue Central American countries.   Here we are 17 years later with our hooks into Iraq, with Ms. Lowey&#8217;s support.   Attempts to meet with her over the last two months have failed.</p>
<p>Dear Ms. Lowey:</p>
<p>  I am writing to let you know that I do not &#8220;support the troops&#8221; in Iraq, and that you are not representing me when you vote more money to keep &#8220;the troops&#8221; in Iraq.        </p>
<p>  Hundreds of thousands of troops have been sent to Iraqi blinded by lies.   There they have been and continue to be routinely ordered to take actions against Iraqis that violate not only our Constitution and international law but virtually every norm of religious and civil society.   All &#8220;the troops&#8221; should know better.</p>
<p>  I do not want any of my tax money to support this kind of behavior, regardless of the goal.   I feel no sense of loyalty or obligation to individuals or commanders who are daily destroying Iraqi life and culture.   In fact, I feel a need to take every non-violent step that I can think of to end this behavior.</p>
<p>  Ms. Lowey, you know very well that the intention of sending our military into Iraq is to establish a base of deadly force for our long-term manipulation of the Middle East, in part to ensure our oil companies will have long-term, extremely profitable access to oil.</p>
<p>  When you and your Democratic and Republican colleagues vote money to &#8220;support the troops&#8221; you know that you are taking advantage in a dispicable way of the innocence, ignorance, good will and sense of loyalty of &#8220;the troops&#8221; and the American public.</p>
<p>  Furthermore, how can you allow to go unchallenged all this talk in Congress about the need for Iraqis to meet benchmarks?   After killing more than half a million Iraqis, and with the abject suffering being visited on Iraqis by the United States each and every minute, what possible right does the United States have to even make a polite suggestion to one single Iraqi?   What is due from America is simply immediate withdrawal, apology and commitment to reparations, with the latter totally managed by Iraqis.</p>
<p>Sincerely,</p>
<p>Nick Mottern</p>
<p>Hastings on Hudson, New York</p>
<p>Posted May 9, 2007</p>
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		<title>By: Required</title>
		<link>http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2007/03/30/kim-on-portland-anarchists/#comment-71319</link>
		<dc:creator>Required</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 May 2007 02:02:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feralscholar.org/blog/?p=485#comment-71319</guid>
		<description>From what I&#039;ve heard Australian troops are just kept out of the most dangerous places for the most part. I know &quot;the Marxists&quot; and at least in my city they don&#039;t control the peace groups. There numbers are miniscule, if they were such a block, it would be easy to set up another group (whichs some conservative groups have) and they wouldn&#039;t have the resources to &quot;control&quot; both groups. But this has been tried and still hasn&#039;t worked. I don&#039;t think it&#039;s the Marxist so much as it is the Marxist and everyone else who doesn&#039;t want to hold any type of protest beyond the meet-march-and-speak routine. 

As you said, a historic amount of people participated in the first round of protests, but that didn&#039;t stop the war, so I think people are a little skeptical of anyone who&#039;s telling them &quot;come to a rally to stop the war&quot; when they know damn well it won&#039;t.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From what I&#8217;ve heard Australian troops are just kept out of the most dangerous places for the most part. I know &#8220;the Marxists&#8221; and at least in my city they don&#8217;t control the peace groups. There numbers are miniscule, if they were such a block, it would be easy to set up another group (whichs some conservative groups have) and they wouldn&#8217;t have the resources to &#8220;control&#8221; both groups. But this has been tried and still hasn&#8217;t worked. I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s the Marxist so much as it is the Marxist and everyone else who doesn&#8217;t want to hold any type of protest beyond the meet-march-and-speak routine. </p>
<p>As you said, a historic amount of people participated in the first round of protests, but that didn&#8217;t stop the war, so I think people are a little skeptical of anyone who&#8217;s telling them &#8220;come to a rally to stop the war&#8221; when they know damn well it won&#8217;t.</p>
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		<title>By: Miranda</title>
		<link>http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2007/03/30/kim-on-portland-anarchists/#comment-71147</link>
		<dc:creator>Miranda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 May 2007 04:01:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feralscholar.org/blog/?p=485#comment-71147</guid>
		<description>Randy (if you read this) re your interest in anti invasion activism elsewhere.I can only say that there is no activism in Melbourne or the other Cities im Australia.After the first rally against the invasion which thousands of people attended interest in Iraq has died.There have been a few poorly attended protests over the four years but thats it.The Marxists control the Peace groups and at a meeting I was told it is time to move on end of story.I have been involved with a few people holding posters in the city and giving out info; but sadly there is no hands on activism by the majority of Australians.
It is interesting that there has been only one Australian Soldier killed in Iraq and this we were told was due to an accident.The soldier was cleaning his weapon or tripped with his weapon.(who knows)The Australian Military are fortunate considering the loss of American lifes.I cant work that out are the Australians superhuman?.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Randy (if you read this) re your interest in anti invasion activism elsewhere.I can only say that there is no activism in Melbourne or the other Cities im Australia.After the first rally against the invasion which thousands of people attended interest in Iraq has died.There have been a few poorly attended protests over the four years but thats it.The Marxists control the Peace groups and at a meeting I was told it is time to move on end of story.I have been involved with a few people holding posters in the city and giving out info; but sadly there is no hands on activism by the majority of Australians.<br />
It is interesting that there has been only one Australian Soldier killed in Iraq and this we were told was due to an accident.The soldier was cleaning his weapon or tripped with his weapon.(who knows)The Australian Military are fortunate considering the loss of American lifes.I cant work that out are the Australians superhuman?.</p>
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		<title>By: Required</title>
		<link>http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2007/03/30/kim-on-portland-anarchists/#comment-70541</link>
		<dc:creator>Required</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 May 2007 00:35:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feralscholar.org/blog/?p=485#comment-70541</guid>
		<description>Miranda, no you didn&#039;t say people were shallow, just that our conversation was &quot;all this nonesense&quot; and that we were some how unaware or ignoring the fact that people were being killed in Iraq. You did not enter nonconfrontationally, so you were not dealth with nonconfrontationally. Having just ridded ourselves of one person who tried to derail conversation in a similar manner, I was a bit quicker to react than I normally would have, but given the circumstances I don&#039;t think &quot;dreg&quot; was particularly harsh. Maybe that makes me a dreg. Anyway...

I live in Australia too. I side with you in saying that the anti-war leadership here is pathetic. Simply craptacular. It&#039;s never really recovered since the beginning of the war. I think because they don&#039;t know what to do. All they no how to do is &quot;inform people&quot; now that people are &quot;informed&quot; and for the most part against the war, the leadership has no idea what to do. 

The types of civil disobedience that the yanks take for granted, even just sitting down on a road, is considered too militant. I think the movement needs to diversify it&#039;s tactics.

A few people burning ONE effigy of a soldier any where is probably not going to have a dramatic impact on any anti-war movement. But even here in Australia, if this type of action was repeated often it would give the right an opportunity to fracture the anti-occupation support base. So would carrying out direct actions and civil disobedience, but they have the possibility of paving the way for real political gains, unlike the effigy burning isn&#039;t going to do much for anyone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Miranda, no you didn&#8217;t say people were shallow, just that our conversation was &#8220;all this nonesense&#8221; and that we were some how unaware or ignoring the fact that people were being killed in Iraq. You did not enter nonconfrontationally, so you were not dealth with nonconfrontationally. Having just ridded ourselves of one person who tried to derail conversation in a similar manner, I was a bit quicker to react than I normally would have, but given the circumstances I don&#8217;t think &#8220;dreg&#8221; was particularly harsh. Maybe that makes me a dreg. Anyway&#8230;</p>
<p>I live in Australia too. I side with you in saying that the anti-war leadership here is pathetic. Simply craptacular. It&#8217;s never really recovered since the beginning of the war. I think because they don&#8217;t know what to do. All they no how to do is &#8220;inform people&#8221; now that people are &#8220;informed&#8221; and for the most part against the war, the leadership has no idea what to do. </p>
<p>The types of civil disobedience that the yanks take for granted, even just sitting down on a road, is considered too militant. I think the movement needs to diversify it&#8217;s tactics.</p>
<p>A few people burning ONE effigy of a soldier any where is probably not going to have a dramatic impact on any anti-war movement. But even here in Australia, if this type of action was repeated often it would give the right an opportunity to fracture the anti-occupation support base. So would carrying out direct actions and civil disobedience, but they have the possibility of paving the way for real political gains, unlike the effigy burning isn&#8217;t going to do much for anyone.</p>
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		<title>By: Randy Morris</title>
		<link>http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2007/03/30/kim-on-portland-anarchists/#comment-70513</link>
		<dc:creator>Randy Morris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 May 2007 21:47:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feralscholar.org/blog/?p=485#comment-70513</guid>
		<description>I will concede to caving to infantile impulse.  I apologize.  

I also really need to stop emotionally reacting to this particular thread---it&#039;s making my blood boil.

Miranda, would you please tell me more about your experiences with anti-war activism and such? I like hearing what others are doing in their areas.

Audrey, your video was awesome...what a disaster still!  And what amazing kids you went with.  Thank you for your effort.

Randy</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I will concede to caving to infantile impulse.  I apologize.  </p>
<p>I also really need to stop emotionally reacting to this particular thread&#8212;it&#8217;s making my blood boil.</p>
<p>Miranda, would you please tell me more about your experiences with anti-war activism and such? I like hearing what others are doing in their areas.</p>
<p>Audrey, your video was awesome&#8230;what a disaster still!  And what amazing kids you went with.  Thank you for your effort.</p>
<p>Randy</p>
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		<title>By: Miranda</title>
		<link>http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2007/03/30/kim-on-portland-anarchists/#comment-70390</link>
		<dc:creator>Miranda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 May 2007 06:20:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feralscholar.org/blog/?p=485#comment-70390</guid>
		<description>I never implied that people were shallow this is an infantile reaction,as is reffering to people as dregs.
in Australia the burning of an effigy of a soldier would make no difference to the mainstream in their support for the anti war and peace groups here.The so called leaders of these peace groups could not even hold a protest outside the American or British Embassy in case they offended people.In fact when there is a protest held re the invasion of IRAQ and this is not often the number of people who attend is sadly very small.So much for the mainstream people here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I never implied that people were shallow this is an infantile reaction,as is reffering to people as dregs.<br />
in Australia the burning of an effigy of a soldier would make no difference to the mainstream in their support for the anti war and peace groups here.The so called leaders of these peace groups could not even hold a protest outside the American or British Embassy in case they offended people.In fact when there is a protest held re the invasion of IRAQ and this is not often the number of people who attend is sadly very small.So much for the mainstream people here.</p>
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		<title>By: aud</title>
		<link>http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2007/03/30/kim-on-portland-anarchists/#comment-70364</link>
		<dc:creator>aud</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 May 2007 02:49:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feralscholar.org/blog/?p=485#comment-70364</guid>
		<description>A few weeks back, I was at Diamond, one of the larger FEMA trailer parks. (Apologies for repeating myself a bit here, for those who watched the video from this.) The kids there are living, on average, five people to a trailer. They live in an area that is surrounded by a chain link fence, with one entrance, with a security guard who logs your license plate and ID if you enter the park (and I am stumbling over that word, because that is so very much not what I think of when I think of a &quot;park&quot;).

Their basketball hoops are vandalized; their playground, built by volunteers and painted in cheerful colors, is vandalized.  A tiny community garden was planted the week before I arrived, and by the time I was there, it had flooded. The plants had floated up and were bobbing past each other in the water, uprooted and dead, in an eerie miniature echo of past events.

Not surprisingly, Diamond is heavily targeted by recruiters. Also, I suppose equally unsurprisingly, one of the volunteers there told me the government is building a prison across the street from Diamond. I don&#039;t know of too many starker situations than having everything you own ripped away from you in a storm, having the government house you in overcrowded FEMA trailers - and knowing your occupancy in the trailer is supposed to end after 18 months, and no other alternative has been provided. If you turn on the news, you can hear people condemning you for having the audacity to live where you were born and raised â€“ as if there was someplace else for you to go. On the far side of the fence is a prison; on the near side is a recruiter. 

Passing judgment on those young people, if they decide to enlist, would require a level of arrogance on my part that I hope I never have. The thought of somebody potentially burning them in effigy for the choices they make, in the absence of what most of us would consider any real choice in life, is sobering.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few weeks back, I was at Diamond, one of the larger FEMA trailer parks. (Apologies for repeating myself a bit here, for those who watched the video from this.) The kids there are living, on average, five people to a trailer. They live in an area that is surrounded by a chain link fence, with one entrance, with a security guard who logs your license plate and ID if you enter the park (and I am stumbling over that word, because that is so very much not what I think of when I think of a &#8220;park&#8221;).</p>
<p>Their basketball hoops are vandalized; their playground, built by volunteers and painted in cheerful colors, is vandalized.  A tiny community garden was planted the week before I arrived, and by the time I was there, it had flooded. The plants had floated up and were bobbing past each other in the water, uprooted and dead, in an eerie miniature echo of past events.</p>
<p>Not surprisingly, Diamond is heavily targeted by recruiters. Also, I suppose equally unsurprisingly, one of the volunteers there told me the government is building a prison across the street from Diamond. I don&#8217;t know of too many starker situations than having everything you own ripped away from you in a storm, having the government house you in overcrowded FEMA trailers &#8211; and knowing your occupancy in the trailer is supposed to end after 18 months, and no other alternative has been provided. If you turn on the news, you can hear people condemning you for having the audacity to live where you were born and raised â€“ as if there was someplace else for you to go. On the far side of the fence is a prison; on the near side is a recruiter. </p>
<p>Passing judgment on those young people, if they decide to enlist, would require a level of arrogance on my part that I hope I never have. The thought of somebody potentially burning them in effigy for the choices they make, in the absence of what most of us would consider any real choice in life, is sobering.</p>
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		<title>By: Charlie</title>
		<link>http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2007/03/30/kim-on-portland-anarchists/#comment-70262</link>
		<dc:creator>Charlie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 May 2007 11:32:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feralscholar.org/blog/?p=485#comment-70262</guid>
		<description>Reguired:

Exactly. Well said.  This is not about shame or guilt, though I have plenty of both.  It really irritates me when people assume that just becuase I have devoted my life to peace and justice work, that I don&#039;t feel guilt and shame for what I did in Iraq.  You don&#039;t go through an awakening and not feel it.  

But our cause is ending the war and stopping the slaughter as well as waking our brothers and sisters who are still in the haze of military conditioning. You don&#039;t do that by targeting soldiers for humiliation and defacing war memorials and the like.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Reguired:</p>
<p>Exactly. Well said.  This is not about shame or guilt, though I have plenty of both.  It really irritates me when people assume that just becuase I have devoted my life to peace and justice work, that I don&#8217;t feel guilt and shame for what I did in Iraq.  You don&#8217;t go through an awakening and not feel it.  </p>
<p>But our cause is ending the war and stopping the slaughter as well as waking our brothers and sisters who are still in the haze of military conditioning. You don&#8217;t do that by targeting soldiers for humiliation and defacing war memorials and the like.</p>
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		<title>By: Required</title>
		<link>http://www.feralscholar.org/blog/index.php/2007/03/30/kim-on-portland-anarchists/#comment-70247</link>
		<dc:creator>Required</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 May 2007 09:37:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://feralscholar.org/blog/?p=485#comment-70247</guid>
		<description>Should read...

Many of the people who are aware of this fact are vets...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Should read&#8230;</p>
<p>Many of the people who are aware of this fact are vets&#8230;</p>
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