18 Comments

1. Lawrence:

   The bees are dying because not enough people care about bees. Biden is Vice President Candidate because not enough people care about war to force Obama to choose an antiwar candidate. Obama can diss his own race and can diss muslims because not enough people care enough about racism and bigotry to force Obama to show some concern for the targets of oppression and state terrorism. And Amylin Pharmaceuticals Inc. dropped in price because enough people care about their investments for them to SELL a risky stock.

   Ergo, enough people care about their money for change to occur, but not enough about bees, racism, and bigotry for change to occur.

   Shades of fear and greed as the great motivators! Or should we say pain and pleasure? At the risk of being denounced by our host as a sophist, I must say that the fear and greed angle should be examined a bit more carefully, if only to give the devil his due without the moral halitosis.

   27 August 2008, 6:07 pm

2. Chris:

   Lawrence’s comment is based upon the premise that the United States is a fully democratic society where people get what they want. If the ignorant and stupid working class simply wised up then that would be reflected in the political institutions.

   Of course, polticians often can’t be “populist” by just doing what people want. In order to get the financing, the support of political infrastructure (such as one of the right-wings of the one party system aka the Democrats) and proper access to the mass audiences through the corporate media - he must sign on to all the symbols that show respect the framework provided by the oligarchy in its various forms.

   In Australia, we had the Howard government for 4 terms despite the fact that all of its major policies were not popular when taken in individual polls. However, the Ruling Party and the loyal Ruling Opposition and the mass corporate media refused to take debate outside of certain parameters allowing the government to continually being relected despite most of its policies being unpopular.

   It sounds as though its the same for the United States. It is largely irrelevant if people oppose the war (for whatever reason) - what will force a withdrawal will require an anti-war movement to draw out the contradictions of occupations and between the different factions of the ruling class. The Democrats are very good at posing as anti-war while simply being for “better” strategies or tactics to win it.

   28 August 2008, 4:41 am

3. jack:

   the war(s) will end once it becomes militarily or economically unfeasible to continue the occupation. either the military will collapse, or our foreign creditors will pull the rug out, until then i fail to see a domestic anti war movement really having much impact other than providing an organizing issue for activists to rally their communities around.

   28 August 2008, 9:47 am

4. Lawrence:

   “Lawrence’s comment is based upon the premise that the United States is a fully democratic society where people get what they want.”

   Can’t really see how you come to that conclusion Chris. In many societies less democratic than the US people have forced change because they, for various reasons, cared enough to do the necessary organizing and activism.

   People in the US could change the society quite quickly if they really cared. They have done so in the past. In the space of a few years there was almost a revolution in the US back in the early 30’s. Contained by the Roosevelt reforms, who only reformed because he and the elites he represented knew that the social movement for change was too strong to be resisted and so must be co-opted to some degree.

   This brings us back to the subject about fear and greed, pain and pleasure, and its relation to social and political change. It’s not a subject that can be exhausted with a word bite or two, or can ever be fully understood, but its worth delving into in my opinion. Pain and pleasure are one of the foundations of animal life, they are part of human nature, not somewhere ‘above’ human nature. And human nature does exist. And human nature is malleable. So what is the relation of this malleable human nature, with its animal foundation in pleasure and pain, to social change or lack thereof, especially in the US? Why are United Statesians so passive in the face of such obvious criminality by their political masters?

   It seems to me that through years of advertising type of research the elite class has succeeded in creating a system of psychological pleasure and pain that paralyzes activism for a better society.

   Think of the pleasure of escaping into a win by your favorite sports team (in my case carolina basketball, i know what i’m talking about!) Think of the pain of anxiety you feel if you don’t have a job, the worry, the loss of status among your peers.

   In the US there is a blanket covering the body politic. There is some movement under the blanket, but really, considering the provocations, it’s just a little bad dream, a turn to a more comfortable side (the democrats) and the movement stops immediately. Its a fact. So, how to rouse ourselves and to rouse others enough to wake up and pull off the blanket? Surely an understanding of the role of fear and greed and pleasure and pain is needed.

   How does it work, in the group and in the individual? It’s basis is partially in thought, memory. Pain is remembered. Greed is the move towards an image carried in the memory, be it a new car or the idea that you have knowledge of some god the human ego has invented or the idea that you are becoming a better human being or the idea that you are becoming non violent. Pleasure is masturbation to an image, a memory, or being seen by others as the embodiment of an image of power and prestige, so that the human props around you support your image of yourself with flattery and servility. Fear is what your peer group will think if don’t conform. All connected to memory and to our animal human nature.

   The “ignorant and stupid working class” don’t wise up because they a enslaved to very effective system of pleasure and pain. Their rage is forever diverted, calmed with drugs of various kinds, and they accept their hopeless passivity in a positive way of not being troublemakers and being above others who are not like them good (white, usually) citizens of the Big Dog country, biggeer and better than any other country, and they get pleasure from this too, this idea of being the biggest and the best.

   28 August 2008, 3:02 pm

5. tochigi:

   Poisoning bees, poisoning people.
   An utterly fake choice between War Party A and War Party B.
   Creating new (subhuman) enemies that we need to spend billions of dollars a day fighting.
   What’s the connection?
   Simple.
   The people with money call all the shots all the time.
   Welcome to the Korporate Necro-Kleptocracy whose business model rests on creating death and disease and enemies, which require an ever-expanding amount of money to “cure”. Not.

   29 August 2008, 3:49 am

6. Tom:

   Hmm bees are important for pollination, and (especially in North America, not sure about Europe) they are effectively the only pollinators - the populations of others having been destroyed, if memory serves - hence putting a greater section of agriculture in jeopardy. This may lead to higher food prices, which may lead to a US populist push for lower fuel prices, hence enabling the ruling groups in US to push for greater control over Iraq - a good section of the US populace may see it as being to their wallets’ advantage. Also, there may be a greater push toward increasing the crop-yield end with higher hydro-carbon fertilizers.

   Europe’s access to hydrocarbons is still largely negotiated to my understanding by USA but with greater control through US access - hmm Georgia, Indonesia & Malaysia (biodiesel plantations) - and that dependence on USA control is strained by the pressure on agriculture from harmed bees. Cool! (the insight, not the situation…)

   Of course, demonizing Muslims aids the ‘Iraq drive *- “how can you let those terrorists get away with it?” - and may push other otherwise reluctant people in the “appropriate” direction. Of course, Mr Obama’s speech last night pushed in precisely that direction, in terms of his tangible statements - the pleasantaries and almost-promises were rather amazing - Mr Biden looked uncomfortable.

   Of course, the side effects of the pesticides are similar to agriculture as the side-effects of the diabetes medication on overall health, but there is also a connection with falling profitability - Mr Obama’s likely bailout of the Merrill Lynch et al companies…

   * I don’t believe for a moment that Mr Obama and Co will remove US bases & forces from ‘Iraq - but this is also connected to Afghanistan & Iran…

   29 August 2008, 12:01 pm

7. VJP:

   I couldn’t figure out what Biden’s ’stumble’ was.

   Interestingly, the original title for Zunes’ article is ‘Biden, Iraq, and Obama’s Betrayal’.

   29 August 2008, 2:19 pm

8. audrey:

   Squash.

   All these stories remind me of the squash in my garden. I had various successes and failures; some got attacked by squash borers or powdery mildew, lived out their natural lives, then withered. Others are still producing a modest crop. One set of vines, though, has enthusiastically overtaken the trellises, moved into the flower garden and continued from there. I didn’t recognize them quickly enough for what they were. I told my family that these were the heirloom melons I’d planted - and declared my melon surge a success.

   When the melons finally appeared in another area, I didn’t pull out the invading vines - I continued to water them. That’s how life is. If plants are in the garden, you water them so they don’t wilt. Shades of Biden - the evidence is disproven, there are no WMDs, there is no threat; but if we are going to war we need to sell the story, fund the occupation, support the troops. I kept staking my vines. I didn’t know what was growing, but from a distance my garden looked impressive.

   Maybe, I decided, these were the acorn squash - a mutant orange variety that would magically transform into the right shape as they matured. I’ve grown acorn squash before and deep down I know how they look when they are young, and this wasn’t it. All the same, under the theory that all growth is good growth, I let them stay.

   These mystery squash kept producing little fruit and because they were so productive, I gave them more and more space. Bayer would have been proud. Their pesticides produced more and more dead insects, and because dead insects mean more growth, more growth for farmers, more growth for investors, they continued down that path. Iatrogenesis. I had to go back to Insurgent American to find what that word was, when the cure is worse than the problem it is fixing. Amylin’s medication falls under that heading. The so-called war on terror, with its requisite demonization of All Things Muslim falls under that heading.

   Now it appears my squash might be inedible gourds; they are a miniature flat pumpkiny sort of creature. I steamed one, then it sat on the counter while I stared at it, afraid to consume it. If I were starving I’d eat it, and I guess that’s some kind of success for a garden. It all depends how you define success. As a teacher, we have all these metrics from No Child Left Behind. Children fill in the right bubble on a multiple choice test, we have success. Bayer kills a lot of insects and makes a profit. Amylin creates a pill to treat diabetes. Success. We harass and eradicate some number of “extremists” through the Patriot Act, through our surge in Iraq, through our continued demonization and vigilantism. Success. More democrats (D) get voted into office. Success.

   And me, I have all these melonsquashgourds. Success. Just don’t look too closely at what my metrics represent. I can’t eat them, I suspect I could have grown a lot more edibles if these hadn’t been in the way, and I’m afraid to throw them in my compost lest they reproduce into eternity. No matter, I have a lot of them. They were the most successful plant in my garden this year.

   I know I should just pull all those vines - I should go do it now - but then I will have giant bare spots; my garden will be an embarrassment. I’m afraid of uprooting so much stuff all at once, even though in my heart I know that’s what has to happen if the good fruits are to have room to grow.

   30 August 2008, 3:22 pm

9. Lawrence:

   “I had to go back to Insurgent American to find what that word was, when the cure is worse than the problem it is fixing. Amylin’s medication falls under that heading. The so-called war on terror, with its requisite demonization of All Things Muslim falls under that heading.”

   great improv! but what PROBLEM is the (state) terroristic ‘war on terror’ curing?

   L.

   30 August 2008, 5:55 pm

10. Stan:

    what PROBLEM is the (state) terroristic ‘war on terror’ curing?

    It’s providing an enemy, at first mostly fictional, but self-realizing.

    30 August 2008, 6:49 pm

11. James M:

    “Iatrogenesis.” Thanks for reminding me of that one.

    One of the best things this site provides is vocabulary for describing conditions that might otherwise take paragraphs to explain. I wonder if someone can help me with another vocabulary word — is there one to describe “a ‘wonder remedy’ or palliative for a condition which never should have been allowed to arise in the first place”? Or like an elaborate ingenious technological fix-it for a problem that could have been prevented with simple common sense and low-tech methods? (Iatrogenesis seems to only imply a stupid solution to a problem; it doesn’t connote that stupidity was the problem’s original source.)

    Case in point:

    FDA OKs zapping greens for safety

    Also, see various “creative” solutions for global warming such as:

    Scientists propose spraying the ocean with iron to fight global warming

    These also tend to be iatrogenic; irradiation, despite its apologists’ reassurances, is terrible for food and health … while using iron shavings to feed phytoplankton has the potential to create myriad as-yet unforeseen problems.

    Is there a word for this kind of “thinking”?

    30 August 2008, 8:09 pm

12. Stan:

    Don’t have a vocab word for the problem you describe (I’ll bet De does when she gets back). I have a term though for a good deal of the solution, as far as technology anyway. It’s the precautionary principle.

    31 August 2008, 1:31 pm

13. Lawrence:

    Q. what PROBLEM is the (state) terroristic ‘war on terror’ curing?

    A. It’s providing an enemy, at first mostly fictional, but self-realizing.

    Then the problem is the lack of an enemy.

    Q. Why is the lack of an enemy a problem?

    A. Because the military industrial complex must constantly justify its GREED for the collective resources of the population and to do so must constantly induce FEAR in the populace by creating an enemy to be afraid of.

    Once humanity had real enemies, such predatory animals who could eat humans whenever they pleased. The fear was real, the need for unity and resistance to the predator was real.

    Perhaps this created the psychological possibility to create other imaginary enemies, such as Lucifer, in order to justify the priest and warrior class, for defense against outside and inside threats.

    both political parties continue to use the Global War on Terror as the framework for creating the fear and justifying the greed.

    see for example http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=9995

    1 September 2008, 2:54 am

14. a beekeeper:

    >The bees are dying because not enough people care about bees.

    Ever look into the ‘caring’ about bees? $300 for a suit so you don’t get stung much. $65 per package of bees. $5 per comb in the hive (8,9, or 10 of these per main body/super)
    So to get a hive up and running - $110-$200 a hive.

    Now add in a honey spinner ($800). All so you can make $2 a lbs for the honey. (Kallas Honey - 48 lbs tub @ $2 a lbs)

    Now add in winter kill, disease, and laws that limit where you can keep bees, thus mandating you having to drive 60+ miles to a location where you can keep your bees. (and the bees should be visited every few weeks - unless you are queen rearing)

    My next expense? $300 for some queen rearing crap so I can expand my beekeeping.

    Now - how many of you would ‘care’ enough to bother with the above?

    1 September 2008, 8:35 am

15. James M:

    Because the military industrial complex must constantly justify its GREED for the collective resources of the population and to do so must constantly induce FEAR in the populace by creating an enemy to be afraid of.

    This is an example of another vocab word I learned here, “dogwaggery.” An apparatus arises to address a real problem, but the apparatus must also work to perpetuate that same problem in order to justify its continued existence. (Kinda like how my city needs to create all sorts of arcane parking rules because it would quickly go bankrupt without people violating them.)

    Don’t have a vocab word for the problem you describe (I’ll bet De does when she gets back).

    If De doesn’t have it, I suspect someone’s going to have to coin it. These kinds of pseudo-solutions seem to abound in discussions of the environment, health, and food. The Omnivore’s Dilemma, for example, is packed full with examples.

    The first thing that comes to mind is “compound stupidity” (or “fallacy” or something like that.)

    1 September 2008, 4:05 pm

16. Lawrence:

    “An apparatus arises to address a real problem, but the apparatus must also work to perpetuate that same problem in order to justify its continued existence. (Kinda like how my city needs to create all sorts of arcane parking rules because it would quickly go bankrupt without people violating them.)”

    Great example about the parking rules. Reminds me of something that I realized not long ago so simple that it makes one realize that the simple things are often the hardest to notice, unless you have a concrete example or someone points it out.

    I visited a place where the public transport is ‘free’ (Chapel Hill/Carrboro) at the point of usage. Paid by taxes of one sort or another. At first it struck me as an obvious money loser. Then I returned to my current home in Europe, a city with great public transport that is paid at point of use. I thought about how much money is SPENT simply on collecting money, managing the money, designing the collection, administering the whole shebang, and enforcing the collection of the money (teams of men who get on the tramway and ask for tickets). If you really think about the whole process it is incredibly expensive, however it does provide jobs. But imagine the problems that never need to be addressed simply by making something ‘free’ at point of usage.

    By the way, I agree that there was a ‘real problem’ which preceded the solution we call the military industrial complex and the fear machine. The problem was the Great Depression (the real defining historical period of the 20th century, in my opinion) showed that capitalism required state socialism in order to survive, that is, welfare for the rich is a neccessity for the system of greed to function within the framework of relative democracy and freedom.

    2 September 2008, 7:04 am

17. Sally Ferrell:

    Hi Stan!
    We met in Wilkes Co NC a few years ago when you & Charlie Anderson spoke in Wilkesboro.
    Looks like you are still busy raising awareness & hell, as am I.

    We had a nice piece of publicity lately – AP story, widely distributed…..much favorable response
    (tho not locally!)
    http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/08/29/america/Counter-Recruiting.php

    Anyway, heard you might be hanging out in western NC these days? & wanted to invite you to come to school
    With us for counter-recruiting if you’d enjoy it(In the event we are successful getting our access restored)

    Keep up the good work!
    Sally Ferrell

    2 September 2008, 2:29 pm

18. Lesly:

    The pursuit of money/power facilitated with bullshit.

    3 September 2008, 9:18 pm

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